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How compelling is the CW winderhand grip

simonpg

New Member
I'm trying to be careful not to allow my "Hassy passion" become an addiction.

However, since I've had my 503CW, I can't help but wonder if there are compelling reasons to add the CW wider/grip.

I tend to use my 501CM exclusively on a tripod using the WLF for all sorts of landscape and city scape shooting.

Now my recently acquired 503CW is my "hand-held" shooter - street; environmental portraits; travel stuff. I use it with the PM45 finder.

So, I wondered if the CW would be the final piece to an ergonomically near-perfect hand-held puzzel - no need to manually wind on; preferred right hand holding and firing of the shutter; nice balancing of an MF SLR body held to the eye while viewing at 45 degrees etc.; nice setup with a D40 mounted on the prism for fill flash.

So my questions of experienced 503 body users are: are the benefits of a CW for my type of use compelling enough to invest a significant sum; do you feel it is nice to have but not compelling to have (now that you have one)?

I'm not so concerened about its price - i.e. $400 versus $700 - but, simply at whatever not-insignificant sum it costs.

Thanks for your comments and thoughts.
 

fotografz

Active Member
Yes, IMO it is well worth it. I always use the CW winder when shooting weddings Simon. The hectic pace, and "gotta get the shot" nature of weddings is an acid test for any camera system ... one which the 503CW, CW winder and D40 is a well proven kit. The CW winder is better than the 200 series winder IMO because it is sculpted to the hand and features a hand strap that allows you to drop the camera to your side in-between shot sequences ... (the rig gets heavy after 5 hours of steady shooting)
 

qnu

Banned
One great feature of the CW winder is that it comes off when you do not need it.
 

simonpg

New Member
Many thanks Marc and Qnu. I gather that it is one of those things that when you have one, you could not live without it.

Marc, if the ergonomics are as good as the current flash grip, then it must be great. As a pro, you'd be a far better judge of that than I.

Qnu, I totally agree; a subtle but important benefit [relative to all other things of course
]. It was one factor that lead me to the EOS 1vHS compared to the F5, 5 years ago when I made the move to AF 35mm SLR. Interestingly Nikon's F6 now has the grip/power unit as a separate component.
 

qnu

Banned
The detachable winder means there is little reason for the EL(...) models to continue.

Thus one part of the Hasselblad system is undermining another part of the Hasselblad system.


P.S.
I get the dark grey again...
 

fotografz

Active Member
The EL cameras are designed for mass production like studio catalog work. It's motor will most likely outlast all of us. If I remember correctly, it is also more suited for multi-shot digital back work compared to the 503CW because the mirror can be set to not return at all, where that of the 503CW returns even when the mirror-up function is activated.

I think the 503CW with motor winder weighs less than the EL camera, and is without doubt a more ergonomic ... at least that's what my shoulder and back remembers : -)

As Q.G points out, the Winder CW can be removed in seconds and replaced with the manual winder. I carry the manual winder in the bag when shooting weddings with the 503CW in case the wnder fails or the batteries run out of juice.
 

qnu

Banned
If I remember correctly, it is also more suited for multi-shot digital back work compared to the 503CW because the mirror can be set to not return at all, where that of the 503CW returns even when the mirror-up function is activated.

The EL models are exactly the same: no permanent mirror lock up.
The mirror comes down after every single exposure, even in the "R(epeat)" mode.

The only Hasselblads with a permanent mirror lock up are the 2000-series cameras. And you can put a winder on the FCW models too.
 

fotografz

Active Member
Thanks Q.G., I wasn't sure since it's been awhile since using the EL version. This is true for the ELD also?

This is a bit of a problem since nothing can move during multi-shot, and even a mirror vibration is too much for critical 4 or 16 shot applications. I'll have to investigate this further
to find out how the back controls the shoot interval when doing Multi-Shot. Maybe it delays it so the camera has time to settle before each exposure.

I know it works on a H camera because they communicate back and forth, and the H has a permanent lock-up.

"The only Hasselblads with a permanent mirror lock up are the 2000-series cameras. And you can put a winder on the FCW models too"

No help there since the Multi-Shot CF backs can't be used on any 200 series camera. The Hasselblad H has permanent lock up also.
 

qnu

Banned
No help there since the Multi-Shot CF backs can't be used on any 200 series camera.

Not even with C/CF/CFi lenses?
Shutter curtains too close to the sensor?

(By the way, the 200-series models do not have permanent mirror lock-up. Only the 2000-series models do.
I know you know that, Marc, but maybe not everyone reading this?)
 

carl_sanders

New Member
Hi there, with regards to the wieght of the CW winder being lighter than the EL, doubtful, With the amount of batteries in the winder (6), the glass prism and battery and the weight of the digital back, this camera weighs a ton to the unfamiliar hand / arm! It has been such a long time since all this weight has been carried around, it is quite novel. The camera is absolutely huge by comparrison but at the same time a delight! Time for the gym!
 

wbulte

Active Member
Hi Carl,

I've briefly played with a CW-equipped camera. It sure is quite some weight to carry around. The body with mounted winder becomes a bit of an awkward affair to store in a camera bag. Not my thing I decided. All in all I think the ELM or ELX that I have here are more 'handy'.

Oh, and I generally prefer carrying my 500CM's for landscape work, much better for my back


This is again one of these personal preference things, try and determine what you like best is the guiding principle.

Wilko
 

semmelblad

New Member
Just a sidenote. A used excellent or even mint 500EL/M will cost half as much as a used CW winder. Even a 500ELX with TTL-flash sensor and large mirror is much cheaper.


Ulrik
 

wbulte

Active Member
Carl,

Why are you carrying 2 batteries in the EL? One will do nicely. Or in the newer models 5 AA (penlight) cells.

I homebuilt a adapter thingy that allows me to drive my ELX & ELM with a plain 9V battery.

Wilko
 

qnu

Banned
Carl,

Without batteries*, an EL weighs about 1,2 kg, a 503 CW weighs about half, 600 grams. The winder CW weighs in at about 360 grams.
So the 503 CW is either 960 grams or 600 grams, depending on whether or not you need the winder. The EL always weighs 1200 grams.

(*The EL takes 1 (one) AA battery less than the Winder CW. How many grams is that?
Weights are without lens, viewfinder or magazine too. They of course weigh the same, no matter what camera they are used on.)

But the point, of course, is not the weight.
The point is that the bulk and weight of an EL is rather more a fixed entity than that of a 503 CW + winder combination.
 

fotografz

Active Member
Time for the Gym indeed "noodle arms" :)

I have carried both cameras for a decent amount of time ( weddings ). I know the EL camera is heavier.

The 503CW and winder with the hand strap allows you to carry the camera at your side. I do not use a neck strap.

The EL cameras are awakward to hand hold and cannot be held in that manner.

I store my 503CW with winder on it's side with the winder handle upwards.
 

carl_sanders

New Member
Arf! Arf! "noodle arms", just about right! ;-) Have been using a small format for too long,
will get used to the present set up, never mind the arms what about the legs!

Do not have an EL anymore, just recall they had two blue batteries. We used EL's in underwater housing for Comex Diving deep sea work with 70mm backs.

Agree about the handstrap, really comfortable, the wieght of the camera helps stability.
 
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